Only two things put heat in the motor, making hp and abuse.
If you already pegged it a couple of times your doing the right thing taking it down, because that's enough to give you a bearing issue, if you didn't already have one.
High oil temperature
Started by team97racing, Jun 16 2014 08:38 PM
39 replies to this topic
#21
Posted 17 June 2014 - 09:26 AM
#22
Posted 17 June 2014 - 09:32 AM
all the replies have valid reasons for increased oil temp----but I have to go with the Legend on this one
you have too much oil in it
there should be a sight plug on the pan for oil level----it should never be coming out and IF you are using a cooler you MUST have the engine running to check the level
we have had customers install quality oil coolers and the temp go UP and it was because the level was too high
Brad
My cooler is still in the box, I haven't had time to install it. Opening night I had 7 1/2qts oil and 2 bottles STP, oil temps that night were about 300 or so.
#23
Posted 17 June 2014 - 09:34 AM
Only two things put heat in the motor, making hp and abuse.
If you already pegged it a couple of times your doing the right thing taking it down, because that's enough to give you a bearing issue, if you didn't already have one.
That is what I was thinking, opening night was something like 38 degrees outside temp. And opening night it was about 300...
#24
Posted 17 June 2014 - 09:40 AM
I have been running Valvoline VR1 20w-50 for 10 years, and have never had the temp over 280 degrees. But this year my oil temps have been 300+ for 6 weeks in a row. Water temp is 200, and oil pressure is 30-40 hot idle.
Pulled the filter and cut the housing. No metal in the filter. Changed oil and it isn't burnt or have a burnt smell. Checked the gauge and it is reading right.
Anyone else experiencing high oil temps with VR1?
Try synthetic racing oil...ran 20 degrees cooler for me......years ago
#25
Posted 17 June 2014 - 12:26 PM
My cooler is still in the box, I haven't had time to install it. Opening night I had 7 1/2qts oil and 2 bottles STP, oil temps that night were about 300 or so.
OK---I understand that you know how much oil you put in but do you know what the actual level is and where the actual level should be------it is very important not to overfill the engine
#26
Posted 17 June 2014 - 12:33 PM
Not sure if anyone's hit on this yet. Distributor problems, or too much timing will cause the oil to heat up. Have the distributor checked, and/or back up the timing (maybe for a heat race) and see if it cools down.
Mark
Edited by frnky1, 17 June 2014 - 12:49 PM.
#27
Posted 17 June 2014 - 02:25 PM
What brand / # oil filter are you using? You may have a restriction there if the filter has been "redesigned".
In testing with boiling water that gets you to 220, you need to test it at 300+, the temps your seeing.
A deep fryer works nicely !
#28
Posted 17 June 2014 - 03:51 PM
I have been running a Fram HP4What brand / # oil filter are you using? You may have a restriction there if the filter has been "redesigned".
In testing with boiling water that gets you to 220, you need to test it at 300+, the temps your seeing.
A deep fryer works nicely !
Edited by team97racing, 17 June 2014 - 03:51 PM.
- team97racing likes this
#29
Posted 17 June 2014 - 04:24 PM
it will help to switch to WIX
#30
Posted 17 June 2014 - 05:05 PM
Agree, Wix (NAPA GOLD SERIES) is the only filter I ever use/reccommend. (I've cut open a LOT of spin on filters )
Wix has not decreased the surface area, nor the quality of their filter media inserts and parts.
Curious of engine configuration.
Were lifters replaced in the off season?
Edited by BUTTBEAK, 17 June 2014 - 05:20 PM.
#31
Posted 17 June 2014 - 09:39 PM
Ask the guys over on the speedtalk.com forum
#32
Posted 18 June 2014 - 10:31 PM
Kyle, please find me this weekend at Skips pit. I would like to help if I can. I have to agree with Brad on to much capacity in the pan. If your clearances are right you should see no higher than 60 to 70 degrees of oil temp above actual coolant temp on a standard 8qt. wet sump set up with no cooler. The cooler i do however strongly recommend! Fill the cooler, new lines, filter adapter and any other part added to the system with water and measure what you have. You only need to add that amount of oil to the system and in some cases less! Also, just a thought, if your engine has been freshened yearly and the bore size not corrected or pistons replaced, you may be starting to build to much crankcase pressure from slight blow by. A little to much blow by will wreck havoc on oil temps due to the pressure and heat from the rings strugglin to seal! Just my 2 cents fella
#33
Posted 19 June 2014 - 12:10 AM
Kyle, please find me this weekend at Skips pit. I would like to help if I can. I have to agree with Brad on to much capacity in the pan. If your clearances are right you should see no higher than 60 to 70 degrees of oil temp above actual coolant temp on a standard 8qt. wet sump set up with no cooler. The cooler i do however strongly recommend! Fill the cooler, new lines, filter adapter and any other part added to the system with water and measure what you have. You only need to add that amount of oil to the system and in some cases less! Also, just a thought, if your engine has been freshened yearly and the bore size not corrected or pistons replaced, you may be starting to build to much crankcase pressure from slight blow by. A little to much blow by will wreck havoc on oil temps due to the pressure and heat from the rings strugglin to seal! Just my 2 cents fella
this is what message boards should be. racers helping racers. good stuff.
#34
Posted 19 June 2014 - 05:24 AM
I have heard of water temperatures running high because once the cross hatch pattern is worn off the cylinder walls the oil that normally splashes up doesn't stick and it causes increased friction between the rings and the walls but I've never heard of that increasing oil temp
#35
Posted 19 June 2014 - 07:58 AM
Me either legend, but you know how it goes, everyones a motor builder, LOL.
#36
Posted 19 June 2014 - 09:41 AM
IMHO, oil retention because of cross hatching is meaningless. Cross hatching does nothing more then create a rough surface. It's not possible for oil held below the high areas of the cross hatch, to lubricate anything. A thin film of oil between two smooth surfaces, will always lubricate better then less oil constantly being scrapped off of rough surfaces.
The same wrong thought is given when a machine shop or engine builder tries to cut corners either because their lazy or to increase profit for time spent, knurling valve guides instead of replacing valve guides.
The argument on valve guides usually goes, it will take up the slop and the low spots will hold oil and lubricate better. The same result will occur. Oil held in the low spots will be meaningless because it will not be able to be used as a lubricant. And the reduced surface area and multiple surface areas will increase wear. When it doesn't last long, then it's well I tried to save it and save you a buck but it didn't work. Most likely who ever talked you into it and did it for you, couldn't have or didn't know how to replaced the valve guides in the first place.
#37
Posted 19 June 2014 - 10:03 AM
Dirt student are you an elite engine builder ?? Have your engines ever won any 10k plus races ??
#38
Posted 19 June 2014 - 11:22 AM
Dirt student are you an elite engine builder ?? Have your engines ever won any 10k plus races ??
No.
The opinion and information I offered about cross hatch and knurling differs from what you explained, but it is not wrong. I did not reference your name, I only offered my opinion. What I presented is different from what you explained, I can't change the fact there is a difference.
I do have 40+ years experience working on many hundreds of different kinds of very complex mechanical equipment, which rely on many types of lubrication systems to work reliably. I have worked on and been trained on mechanical equipment over the years so small jewelers tools are needed, to complex equipment 30+ feet long, needing months of training to become certified. For over 40 years I have spent around two months of the year on training and certifications. At one time I was certified by the State of Ohio to teach auto repair among other state certifications, including how engines work and are repaired with hands on experience. During my military service I also worked on complex mechanical equipment. I have never seen cross hatching or knurling designed in and used in any application for the purpose of lubricating moving parts.
Edited by dirtstudent2, 19 June 2014 - 12:06 PM.
#39
Posted 19 June 2014 - 11:30 AM
Knurling of valve guides isn't done in real racing engines however a specific cross hatch pattern is used during the honing process. I understand that part of the purpose is to seat the rings but it was explained to me by an engine builder I trust that worn cylinder walls create higher than normal water temperatures
#40
Posted 19 June 2014 - 12:15 PM
Knurling of valve guides isn't done in real racing engines however a specific cross hatch pattern is used during the honing process. I understand that part of the purpose is to seat the rings but it was explained to me by an engine builder I trust that worn cylinder walls create higher than normal water temperatures
If your answering me I appreciate your information. Thank you
edit: I can't argue "worn cylinder walls (can) create higher than normal water temperatures". My nature always makes me ask why it causes higher than normal water temperatures. The mechanic in me tells me who cares why, fix the cylinder walls and the over temperature problem will be gone. Then my nature of wanting to know why comes back and makes me unsure. I start wondering if usage caused the worn cylinder walls or if there's another problem which is the real cause.
Edited by dirtstudent2, 19 June 2014 - 12:28 PM.
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