34 replies to this topic

[Racer17L]

I'm not saying this is the smart thing to do, but in the last 10 years I never had a fire extinguisher within my reach driving.  At PPMS, a fire suppression system was always "recommended".  My question is, if you hit the wall hard and get knocked out (I have) or roll the car and are trapped upside down (I have) a fire extinguisher or suppression system you have to pull does you no good.  Nor would I stay in the car and discharge it.  I'd get the heck out if conscious.  I still think a track needs to provide quality fire crews/safety crews for their drivers.

[LM RACING]

It is always an unfortunate situation when a car catches fire. Sometimes can be catastrophic. Anything you can do to help the safety of your own car is a plus. Some things are unavoidable. But it is no excuse to not have fire safety at a track.

[old man d]

You have some good points Vince,yes sometimes sh*t happens. Just glade you were not hurt. I have hit the wall also but i guess i was lucky nothing happened like what you went through. But, i"m sure there were times a fire extinguisher was used.

[Street Stocker]

Drivers should have some kind of fire extinguisher at their reach, and a fire suppression system is even better.  But this does not excuse the track from having a real fire truck with trained fire men in full gear.    After what happened this spring, if any track is operating with anything less the drivers should not even go on the track.

[starboyshady]

I'm not sure if I want to hit a fire extinguisher at speed that fell off of a car ...... Not sure how it could be safely mounted . A track should have trained safety personnel to handle fire & extraction . And YES , pa does have requirements that must be met to be a fire department ... In order to get state funding there are requirements ....... A fire dept will take a truck & crew to the track to provide this service . But the track must make it worth it in some way for them to volunteer their time & bring their half million dollar truck there . Like they get the 50/50 etc

[FanJim24]

I was told lernerville has Buffalo Twp. Fire Dept. with one of their trucks serving the track.

full truck and a quad with a pump and tank that I presume carries foam. Lernerville learned from a near disaster.

[FanJim24]

An in-car extinguisher is just about useless with fuel pouring out and reflashing. Drivers expended at least 2 of them on Charlie Holben, to no avail. That's why Buffalo Two got the quad.

[jo73]

You still have to have pepole to get to a driver ! Just because there is a bottle in the car doesn't mean anything if your hurt, or in a multiple crash and can't get out of the car.

[Walt Wimer]

Let me tell you a story!!  This goes back to the late 1960s at the nationally known Martinsville Speedway.  They were having a big NASCAR Modified race back in the coupe days. Qualifying was on Saturday with the race on Sunday. During time trials a car hit the first turn wall full bore. The driver luckily scampered out very quickly as the car burst into flames. Since it was just a qualifying day, all the track had on hand was a pick-up with several guys with extinguishers. But they didn't know how to fight the fire and where to aim the extinguishers as the fuel line was broken and feeding the fire.  As luck would have it, driver Dave Stewart and his son had gone to Martinsville with me to watch the race. We were all in the pits watching time trials.  Stewart was a full time Fireman for the city of Butler. Some of you old timers may remember him as the "Flying Fireman" at such tracks as Butler, Mercer &  Blanket Hill.  Stewart realized the guys were having trouble with the fire and ran down the turn one to give them a hand. With his help they got the fire out, but the car, a 1937 Chevy coupe, was burned to a crisp!!  Had the driver been injured or knocked out he surly would have perished!!  This is the same Martinsville you watch twice a year on TV with NASCAR Cup races and all they had for time trials on Saturday was a pick-up with extinguishers and a bunch of guys who didn't know how to use them!!!   With what happend in Ohio a couple of months back, all area track owners and promoters should sit up and take notice and make sure their fire protection is up to snuff!!  I have no idea what Roaring Knob's Fire protection is since I have never been to that track.  But if it isn't what it should be, then don't race there!!    Simple as that...the drivers that race there have to make the decision whether to race or not!!

 

GOOD RACING TO ALL

 

Walt 

[jo73]

Flick, Wolfgang and many others have paid a horrible price for being caught in a car fire. Many have had the thought, it won't happen to me, all drivers need to look at a tracks safety and make there decision. I believe it was that last year the fire department was no longer permitted to have a 50/50. WHY NOT ??? During that pissing match, if memory serves me correctly, there was no ambulance present. Again, these guys are making there choice to race there. Hopefully no one pays the price that others have.

[cdm]

I'm not sure if I want to hit a fire extinguisher at speed that fell off of a car ...... Not sure how it could be safely mounted . A track should have trained safety personnel to handle fire & extraction . And YES , pa does have requirements that must be met to be a fire department ... In order to get state funding there are requirements ....... A fire dept will take a truck & crew to the track to provide this service . But the track must make it worth it in some way for them to volunteer their time & bring their half million dollar truck there . Like they get the 50/50 etc

Please show me the requirements, because in my 40 years in the fire service, 10 years as Chief, 10 years as a local level instructor, I have never came across them.  The only state funding is a grant for about $10,000 a year.  There is a voluntary certification (for having a certain number of pro-board certified firefighters) that will increase your amount on the grant (by about a $1000.)

[FanJim24]

Let me tell you a story!!  This goes back to the late 1960s at the nationally known Martinsville Speedway.  They were having a big NASCAR Modified race back in the coupe days. Qualifying was on Saturday with the race on Sunday. During time trials a car hit the first turn wall full bore. The driver luckily scampered out very quickly as the car burst into flames. Since it was just a qualifying day, all the track had on hand was a pick-up with several guys with extinguishers. But they didn't know how to fight the fire and where to aim the extinguishers as the fuel line was broken and feeding the fire.  As luck would have it, driver Dave Stewart and his son had gone to Martinsville with me to watch the race. We were all in the pits watching time trials.  Stewart was a full time Fireman for the city of Butler. Some of you old timers may remember him as the "Flying Fireman" at such tracks as Butler, Mercer &  Blanket Hill.  Stewart realized the guys were having trouble with the fire and ran down the turn one to give them a hand. With his help they got the fire out, but the car, a 1937 Chevy coupe, was burned to a crisp!!  Had the driver been injured or knocked out he surly would have perished!!  This is the same Martinsville you watch twice a year on TV with NASCAR Cup races and all they had for time trials on Saturday was a pick-up with extinguishers and a bunch of guys who didn't know how to use them!!!   With what happend in Ohio a couple of months back, all area track owners and promoters should sit up and take notice and make sure their fire protection is up to snuff!!  I have no idea what Roaring Knob's Fire protection is since I have never been to that track.  But if it isn't what it should be, then don't race there!!    Simple as that...the drivers that race there have to make the decision whether to race or not!!

 

GOOD RACING TO ALL

 

Walt 

After sitting between the flagstand and press box when Charlie Holben was upside down and on fire, and watching him try to swipe the flames away from his face, while drivers tried to get the fire out and get him out of the car, with what appeared to be good fire safety at the track, I absolutely agree with this Walt.  

 

One of the really good things about Lernerville is that they made changes after that, the fully equipped UTV being one of them.  They found out that the big tank truck doesn't maneuver well through a bunch of stopped sprint cars, and even though it was just on the other side of the straight away it took what seemed like an eternity to get to the burning car and driver.  

Fire safety is crucial.  

[starboyshady]

@ CDM , I'm not sure where you live , but Alleghehny county has a FIRE ACADEMY in north park and it IS required that you take classes there . They offer many classes but firefighter 1 & 2 must be taken in this county . We have also did classes with allegheny county at Pittsburgh Airport . They have a plane that is controled by computer that simulates a plane crash with a fuel fire . Like I said not sure where you are from , but we have a ton of training around here . And your comment about the 10 grand confirms that you are from a low budget dept , so therefore extensive training wouldn't be a top priority to stay up on technology .

[cdm]

SBS, Then the requirement would be COUNTY, not State.  And the $10,000 is what is given by the State, not our total budget.  My current department operates 3 stations, with 2 Engines, 1 brush truck, 2 tenders and and 2 BLS ambulances.  WE have a requirement that all of our firefighters take Firefighter 1.  Our Chief Officers are required FF II.  We have 3 Local level instructors, and have a contract with Bucks County Community College to provide most of our training.  So I stand by my statement that the State does not have any requirements for firefighters or departments.  I should add that I highly agree with you that trained firefighters should be utilized.  I know that Lake Erie Speedway uses (for its limited schedule) crews with Firefighter 1 (or the old essentials of firefighting,) Vehicle Rescue, Flammable liquid fires,Haz-mat operations, and EMT.  They used to also require NASCAR training.  Eriez Speedway uses a lot of the same crew members.

[bezerker]

Maybe the tracks could get together and get a local fire company or whoever and give training
to teams that would like to learn fire safety. If even one team from each track is trained thats
one step closer to keeping drivers and spectators safe from what could be. I am not saying this
is the only form of safety the tracks have but it would benefit everyone if there is someone
in the pit area or stands (some crew members are in the stands at feature time)to get a start
on what could be a catastrophe that no one wants to happen. Just a suggestion, but I wouldnt
want to just sit there and watch what I can prevent.

Edited by bezerker, 19 June 2016 - 04:10 PM.