51 replies to this topic

[The Legend]

The wizards of smart wrote Bloomquist off as old news when davensnort got hot for 3 months .... And now it looks like the greatest of all time figured out what rumley was doing and now rolled off 4 in a row and the points gap is shrinking fast lol lol you don't stay on top for 30 years by being stupid ....

[jo73]

I have always wondered. Davenport/Rumley had obviously found more speed supposedly through birdcage timing, attachment points and rod lenghts. You go to any Lucas or WoO race and these guys have the rear of these cars covered. It sure as hell isn't for shocks or tires.

I just don't know how guys like Bloomquist or others discover this shit. It's not like they invite driver's and crew over to take a look.

Do they send a spy over to hang out that's wearing his latest Davenport tee or what ?

Again, I've seen these guys back into there pits and the backs of the cars are covered immediately.

Tires have stamps. Crew guys walk around cars in line up area's constantly. They can see compounds and any extra cutting that was done to the tire.

Shocks have internal valving. Looking from the outside tells you nothing.

Springs you can Count wraps and lengths, but, as soon as the cars on the ground your guessing.

That's the shit that makes these guys so dam good.

[The Legend]

Lucas doesn't allow covers after the drivers meeting

[dirtstudent2]

"Tires have stamps. Crew guys walk around cars in line up area's constantly. They can see compounds and any extra cutting that was done to the tire. "

 

Lucas tire tech per 2014 rules I looked at, only are to read markings on the outside of the tire and test with a durometer.  Per 2014 rules I found, it's do what you want to the inside, but no external grip or altering.

 

It's interesting I cannot google and find the same info for 2015.  All the above and what follows is wrong if someone can find 2015 rules which differ then 2014 rules.

 

Here's the 2014 info I found:   http://lucasdirt.com...S-Rule-Book.pdf

 

Is there anything anyone knows about or can find on the web, which indicates there has been and DQ or disciplinary action because of tires, except for 'external' tire markings and alterations or reading too soft per durometer checking?  if not it means Lucas tires are wide open to internal prepping, so long as tread surface meets durometer readings.

 

I'd bet(not much but something), the series because of not wanting to invest in tire testing, loose top racers through DQ's, knowing today's modern tire preps cannot be detected via sniffer, left things as they were in 2014.  They left them as is also because of competing with Dirt.  What better way to draw fans away from Dirt, then to have the fast cars in your series?  

 

I think the  0 car has not been dominate because of finding some magical setup and driving skills.  It's won the last 4 races because the turn around time to get tires and prep the tires by other teams, has allowed for a 4 race dominance by the 0 car.  Then it's a matter of being able to prepare and match their tires, to the 0 car.  It's not about the smoke screen hide what your doing to your chassis mechanically, it's about others not knowing exactly what your doing to your tires.  Tires don't get prepped instantly if your not going to have to worry about failing a durometer check, your taking 3 days and more to prepare a tire.  I think before the end of the season things will even out.   

 

 

If you assume they all understand how their cars work, through years of racing are able to adjust their chassis to track needs and the front runners are all great drivers, the only thing left is get speed altering tires.

 

I pointed out what I found on the web about Lucas and tire rules and testing, but it was from 2014.  If it's changed and they actually do more to test tires, show us were to find the info.  I don't follow late models, you all who do probably will be instantly able to say on here when and where they did test tires for internal prep and DQ'ed someone.  That done it makes all my writing this morning totally worthless to others, but still fun for me to write.  Nothing I like more then to think about and try to figure out how tires on a staggered solid axle car, need to be used on an oval track.  It's also fine to be wrong about your thoughts and told your full of it, so long as your also told why your wrong and you learn from it.

 

What testing has Lucas done on tires this year?

[jo73]

I did not realize that. Answers some questions, but, I still wonder if they have guys hanging around to get them that information. Bloomquist found something, running off 4 in a row.

[The Legend]

Lucas takes a minimum 5 tire samples a night... And tests relentlessly , the one thing you know at a Lucas show is that everyone is on clean tires

[dirtstudent2]

Lucas takes a minimum 5 tire samples a night... And tests relentlessly , the one thing you know at a Lucas show is that everyone is on clean tires

 

Thank you.  I didn't know they took tire samples, only reading in 2014 rules that tire durometer testing would be done.

 

Do they post or offer information anywhere on the results, of testing tire samples?  I'm never seen a sample taken.  How is it done?  I'm guessing a hole saw on a portable drill would be an easy way to get a sample to be tested.  But that's just a guess.  Or do they send confiscate whole tires to be sent in for testing?  A three day weekend with 5 samples a night would mean storage and tracking of 15 tires, until tires could be sent out.  And also a cost to ship and test the tires.

 

Just this past Friday at the Lucas show in Attica, during the rain I got to sit with and hear what a person who worked for the Goodyear NASCAR tire distributor said about tracking NASCAR tires.  He explained all tires are tracked per what car they go to, from distribution to on track use.  A different bit of info, but I found it interesting the distributor got $130 for mounting each tire.  That's what his job was.  Weather it's taking samples or confiscating tires, tracking samples or tires from acquisition to when results are known, would take a lot of labor inputting information.  It's a good thing for racing Lucas invests to do what's needed.

 

Thank you again for the info on samples.

 

edit:  In the scheme of things it really doesn't matter to me what they do to their tires, except for the fun I get out of writing about it with my morning coffee.  I'm sure knowing tires are clean matters to racers, but to me a racing fan putting my money at the front gate, it all good anyway it works out.

Edited by dirtstudent2, 06 September 2015 - 11:03 AM.

[The Legend]

They take samples with a grooving iron in several locations and seal them in a glass vial and take them to a laboratory.they announce if all tires are clean. Tire doping is more of an issue at local tracks where they don't have the money to test

[The Legend]

At eldora this week samples are taken from
All transfer cars and the next spot back and top 5 in the A main plus random samples the rest of the way back .

[dirtstudent2]

Thank you.

[jo73]

When are you heading out to eldora legend ?

[Fwig]

The difference between Bloomer's win streak and Davenport's is Rumley is sharing their setups with their customers where Bloomer isn't. Case in point, Eckert. He's been in a Longhorn for a month and is starting to win races.

 

It will be interesting to see what manufacture is winning all the big shows over the next two months when the big money is up for grabs.

[D1RT]

Well make it five Lucas Oil Series wins in a row for Black Sunshine. He wins the Hillbilly 100 at I-77 last night.

Up next the World 100......

[jo73]

He's always fast at eldora. That and I'm sure another win out there would make one forget all about coming across that scale 25 lbs. Light. He may say he's forgotten all about it. But, someone miscalculated something. He's got to be the favorite going in.

[The Legend]

To say rumley is sharing his stuff is insane .... Remember mason ziglers run from the back at last years world ??? That was with rumley helping ... How many runs like that has he has since ? How many has chub won ? Plenty of horns aren't winning. I strongly believe the vast majority of guys in horns would easily win local shows with rumley standing there

[MBRLLC]

The difference between Bloomer's win streak and Davenport's is Rumley is sharing their setups with their customers where Bloomer isn't. Case in point, Eckert. He's been in a Longhorn for a month and is starting to win races.
 
It will be interesting to see what manufacture is winning all the big shows over the next two months when the big money is up for grabs.

Rumley isn't sharing shit with anybody and from what I have heard from people with longhorns you don't get much help. It's all about Davenport.

[Fwig]

Well I have to disagree, Eckert is getting support from them, that's all I will say. Chub and Boom are getting support as well. All three of these teams have improved significantly.

 

Please explain how "snubbing" your customers that are keeping the lights on, is the best way to build a successful business?

 

With Longhorn's doing well in Lucas, why not put the same technology is a WoO team? Why wouldn't you want market share in both series?

[jo73]

My question is, who is Rumley ? As in where did he come from ? You would think that the people at Longhorn would be sharing this information. Happy customers equals, sales, and I'm sure that's what they are in business for.

[The Legend]

Jo73 clearly you have no idea how this stuff works. They give you a basic generic set up to be used on all tracks and conditions and you adjust from there. Kevin rumley is an engineer hired by the labontes to get long horn cars running well. He uses data acquisition and his engineering degree to make race cars faster specifically the davensnort 6. Make no mistake the number one goal is to win every race they enter just like for Bloomquist , just like for Clanton and just like for the rocket house car. The information they give you barely scratches the surface.what wins on Sunday sells on Monday so as long as the cars are winning they will sell

[jo73]

LOL. Yes I do and yes I understand how that works. I just didn't know where Rumley came from ? I agree totally as to why these guys are so good at what they do. I don't no how long Rumley has been working for the Labonte's or Davenport, but, I do no this. He has gotten those longhorns fast. I guess the big question is. Just how much or how little do they share that information ? That and you no its going to make Richards, Barry Wright and others to start changing things up also. For how fast Davenport has been and know Bloomquist has found something. The touring guys ALL will be collecting information and changing things up.