87 replies to this topic

[Express Man]

Back when Dog Hollow dropped them years ago alot of the open steel block guys had a decision to make, race elsewhere or race with the supers. The motors are good enough to compete with them. We went to TVR and ran our steel block with the supers and had no issue winning races. I think we won 6 (pretty convincingly) at TVR against the open motors. As for the people bashing the steel block drivers I can think of quite a few that are quality drivers that run with the supers just fine like George Dixon who ran top 5 with a all steel 358 last year at Dog Hollow until I believe a mechanical failure ended his night. With that being said there are guys that in the supers with an all aluminum engine that can't hold a line and do the things some say the steel blocks do. Just because they don't have the fancy motor doesn't mean they should be forced to race in a dying division...

Back when Dog Hollow dropped them years ago alot of the open steel block guys had a decision to make, race elsewhere or race with the supers. The motors are good enough to compete with them. We went to TVR and ran our steel block with the supers and had no issue winning races. I think we won 6 (pretty convincingly) at TVR against the open motors. As for the people bashing the steel block drivers I can think of quite a few that are quality drivers that run with the supers just fine like George Dixon who ran top 5 with a all steel 358 last year at Dog Hollow until I believe a mechanical failure ended his night. With that being said there are guys that in the supers with an all aluminum engine that can't hold a line and do the things some say the steel blocks do. Just because they don't have the fancy motor doesn't mean they should be forced to race in a dying division...

Total BS! You guys had steel block engine that was lightened to be competitive ! THAT ENGINE WAS NO HEAVIER THAN THE ALUMINUM FORD ENGINES AT THE TIME. Plus it was built by one of the regions top builders. Not in the basement by uncle nutty! Let's compare apples to apples here....not achorns. And a twenty year Veteran driver...not some young hammer head kid behind the wheel! NOT Even close to a fair comparison?

[rsadiedog]

So what is the difference between a steel block and a super engine? The material the block is made from, and that's is it. The only gain is shedding some weight. Horsepower and torque don't care what you block is made of.

So again what's the difference? It's a excuse for the track to pay less money for the same damn car! You want a true steel block class, make it 358 ci, all steel, stock valve angles, no drysumps, no roller cams. Hmm this is sounding familiar!

[Express Man]

No argument on the horsepower. Big argument on the front end weight. Most rookie drivers moving up to the super late division have a steel block engine because they adapted it from the previous division they were racing. Takes a lot of one to get a top notch Super engine. With that being said.... now will talk about experience. They usually don,t have much. Thus the smashing and spinning starts. BECAUSE FOR THE MOST PART....They are in way over their heads. Let's give these guys a few years experience in that type of car with that type of power..... before we turn them lose in the general population of super latemodel.

[bmb18]

So what is the difference between a steel block and a super engine? The material the block is made from, and that's is it. The only gain is shedding some weight. Horsepower and torque don't care what you block is made of.

So again what's the difference? It's a excuse for the track to pay less money for the same damn car! You want a true steel block class, make it 358 ci, all steel, stock valve angles, no drysumps, no roller cams. Hmm this is sounding familiar!

Agreed that only true difference is block material. However how many 13* or 9* heads or D3 for the ford guys are on a steel block making 780-815hp? None or nearly none. These cars are primarily 500-650hp 18*&23* engines in mostly older cars some still running oil shocks. That being said why shouldn't these guys be running with the supers? Go watch a night at thunder mountain, Marion center, or hummingbird and that will tell u why. These cars tend to create a caution fest and tear a lot of equipment up as well as a large majority that can't hold a line and are dangerous to run close with. And there's a big difference in price on the parts needed to complete competitively in steel block and what is out there on most super lates.

The steel blocks trash $100 shocks and bend clips on 04 rockets. When they collide with a good super the price to fix the same things on both cars isn't even close.

That being said there are a few damn good and very fast steel blocks in the area. That will run with any super around. It's just the fact that 80% of the drivers in that class have no business being on the track with the supers.

[bmb18]

No argument on the horsepower. Big argument on the front end weight. Most rookie drivers moving up to the super late division have a steel block engine because they adapted it from the previous division they were racing. Takes a lot of one to get a top notch Super engine. With that being said.... now will talk about experience. They usually don,t have much. Thus the smashing and spinning starts. BECAUSE FOR THE MOST PART....They are in way over their heads. Let's give these guys a few years experience in that type of car with that type of power..... before we turn them lose in the general population of super latemodel.

I agree 110% Gene. That would save a lot of guys a ton of headache and money.

Edited by bmb18, 16 September 2015 - 11:47 AM.

[The Legend]

There are zero guys running spread bore 10 degree or ry45 stuff with a steel block .... So NO it's not all the same

[rsadiedog]

The problem is there are guys who have or will build a steel blocks and will spend the money to be the bigger dog in the lower class, and when one guy does it, two or three more will follow suit to keep up! And we all know that all you need to win is more power right? Lol.

You are right there are a lot of guys in over their head, make a affordable class that has a little less power so they can learn to drive and set up their cars. I race for 600 to win, 100 to start with a 520 hp motor that I have not a nickel over 5k in. Steel blocks race for 650 to win 100 to start with a motor that potentially can cost 25k or more if you wish.

[WestPA LM Fan]

I agree with ExpressMan also, several good points there. The steel block division just involves more accidents for a variety of reasons.

 

No offense to any drivers though, because there is some good ones even in the steel blocks. But, take Marion Center for example. We attended 7 or 8 races there this year. I saw the super lates 2 different times run green to checkered 25 laps, and only a caution or two on several other occasions. Then, the steel blocks come out, and it is generally a wreck fest and spin fest. Cant blame that on the track, when the supers just went green to checker no yellow.

Edited by WestPA LM Fan, 16 September 2015 - 12:13 PM.

[dirtstudent2]

" Steel blocks race for 650 to win 100 to start with a motor that potentially can cost 25k or more if you wish." 

 

There's a big difference between ending up with an engine upgraded via swap meet parts over a period of time to a 25k engine, and having to fork out 11k+ to 25k+, buying an engine.

 

Steel blocks allow those who over the years score, pistons, rods, cranks, etc., for a cheap price, to put something together and go race.  

 

edit:  Probably 15+ years ago now I remember going to races at North Georgia Speedway, north of Atlanta.  They raced three kids of late models and 4 cylinders FWD as their regular classes.  Super lates, Steel blocks and what were probably 350 lates with closed up back ends.  

 

Each type of car below Super's could be put together from used stuff.  When I looked at the general condition of cars in each class, over all steel block chassis parts didn't look as good as Super chassis parts.  and the late's with closed in back ends over all didn't look as good as the steel blocks.  But, the winners and front runners in each class, were top notch cars.  

 

Racing is about and feeds off of, if you want to race and what you have to do to get your butt in the seat of a car.  Racing is not about if you can or cannot pay the piper.   

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by dirtstudent2, 16 September 2015 - 12:32 PM.

[bmb18]

All I was trying to say is ppl say the only difference between the classes is block material. But there's a much bigger difference in the quality of other components. Yes engine components are the biggest $$$ difference but if you have a new car with top notch equipment and a shitty pill draw you shouldn't need to fear having your pristine chassis by a junk car that drives like a water truck that pulled a 1. You CAN NOT race with some of these guys. If you try you have a good chance of flushing a ton of money down the toilet. I've seen it happen to many times.

[bmb18]

I agree with WestPA LM FAN and student 100% that's why these guys need their own class. To learn together and not tear up top shelf equipment.

[EXRACER]

Once a month the pit fee is $30-$35 when Dan is having one of his "specials"

[rsadiedog]

All I was trying to say is ppl say the only difference between the classes is block material. But there's a much bigger difference in the quality of other components. Yes engine components are the biggest $$$ difference but if you have a new car with top notch equipment and a shitty pill draw you shouldn't need to fear having your pristine chassis by a junk car that drives like a water truck that pulled a 1. You CAN NOT race with some of these guys. If you try you have a good chance of flushing a ton of money down the toilet. I've seen it happen to many times.

Absolutely correct but, but if you think you will get all of the out of control guys out of the supers by making a steel block class you won't. There are plenty of people who have money to buy good stuff who can't drive or set up a race car. There is not true fix to the problem you speak of other than having invitational races.

[racefuel01]

I know of a sreel block that can rt with the supers and beat em on a good night when all the rt choices are made!

[bmb18]

I know of a sreel block that can rt with the supers and beat em on a good night when all the rt choices are made!

I know of a couple of them. In no way was I bad mouthing all steel blocks. It would just be nice to keep the 90% of them that I'm talking about in their own class.

[TRUMPSTAMP]

Problem is in this area it cost as much to run strickly and pro stock(because there is no tech or money limit aka claim rule) that instead of these clowns learning to drive in these classes they throw the same motor in an old late chassis and run steel blocks for the better pay.

[D1RT]

I know of a sreel block that can rt with the supers and beat em on a good night when all the rt choices are made!

 Plenty of super late races left this season.

Let's see how fast he is away from Thunder Mountain and Hummingbird.....

[bmb18]

Very true. It's cheaper to build a top 5 steel block late than a top 5 street stock at Marion Center.

[speedster101]

The dudes running their steel stuff are usually down on power which makes the car WAY easier to drive especially when it slicks off .... If they are doing donuts down on power imagine if they had a hammer lol

[speedster101]

The dudes running their steel stuff are usually down on power which makes the car WAY easier to drive especially when it slicks off .... If they are doing donuts down on power imagine if they had a hammer lol

Imagine if you could drive a stick up a dogs ass. Never mind...... You cant