85 replies to this topic

[ex9Ccrewguy]

I think its been 10 years or so

[Walt Wimer]

I can find his name in my PPMS records back in the early 2000s

 

Walt

[ex9Ccrewguy]

so walt.. maybe 12-13 yrs ?? whats your archives say ?  my damn memory is blank on the exact year..

[flash49]

I think the last race he won at PPMS was a MACS race.  It's been at least ten years since he raced regularly.

[ex9Ccrewguy]

if I recall correctly, the last full season he ran , he had pete loria drive his car Pittsburgher weekend ( he had rib injuries from work that prevented him from driving) , pete piled up the car in a heat race(near totaled)  the car sat wrecked in the trailer most of the winter and froze and cracked the block, which we didn't find till the car was fixed the next spring and we fired it up.. I think that last season he only had the car out a few times.

[Walt Wimer]

My records only show the top three in feature events, so if say, he only raced a few times his final year, it wouldn't show unless he had a top three finish.

 

Walt

[ex9Ccrewguy]

whats your records say at ppms walt?

[RocketRide]

Just reading this,I don't think some of you even know what the word promote means.

[Chad's Dad]

The win lists says three total Late Model wins, but I only have the dates of two of them, those being and 8-9-97 and 8-7-99. 

 

Also shown as having three Limited Late Model wins.

[Wolfie29]

i look at tyler county..........dusty as hell, run down, not alot put into looks, but people will drive  10 hours to see the racing. a surface that promotes side by side racing, don't need all the other circus shit............

Couldn't agree more and Clinton County has side by side racing without the dust....

[Wolfie29]

Just reading this,I don't think some of you even know what the word promote means.

A person or thing that promotes,furthers or encourages.....    A person who initiates or takes part in the organizing of a company, development of a project, ect....    A person who organizes financial backing for a sporting event or entertainment.....

[dirtstudent2]

A person or thing that promotes,furthers or encourages.....    A person who initiates or takes part in the organizing of a company, development of a project, ect....    A person who organizes financial backing for a sporting event or entertainment.....

 

Then i'm a demoter of racing which requires a high percentage of mandatory purchases beyond proven safety equipment, to enter a class of racing. 

 

_________________________________

 

 

 

I'd like to get back to the original subject I tried to get readers on here and especially track owners to think about "Selling tickets, pit passes and concessions verses Selling cost effective racing". 

 

Someone brought up on this site which I can't find again about how car counts for tracks are hurt because there is a special show every weekend taking racers away from local points series.  I agree with what I understood the writer to say.  My point and the point I tried to make with this thread is controlled speck racing for the purpose of selling goods and services to racers does the same. 

 

A forced purchase entry class or move to a controlled cost class is aimed at a particular group of customers.  It takes lower budget racers away from the "top three" classes.  If demanded as a class by tracks it stops all racers who cannot financially meet the new higher "entry level" cost from racing.  I think it also reduces the perceived need for promotion by tracks to gain fans and replaces it with promotion by sellers of goods and services to a specific group of racing customers.  The guise presented to track owners is that dwindling profits from fans can be made up with back gate cost tacked onto racers.  The truth of the matter is to survive and increase profits sellers of mandatory controlled goods and services to racers feed off of controlled car count, not the front or back gate.  Tracks are only a market place for sellers of speck goods and services to racers.  They are business people and nothing else who when and if business slows will move on to something new.   

 

To those who are into racing to sell products and services, tracks are nothing but a cheap store front and controlled customers.  They are no different then the controlled customer racers they sell to.  It's only track owners, racers and fans who are there every Saturday night because of their love of racing.  The only love for racing sellers of goods and services have is about the profits they can take from racers or acquire using what track owners have built.     

 

In my opinion the future and possible complete downfall of racing in this area will be the result of sellers of products and services taking control of local track venues.  To survive sellers of products and services to racers and tracks must have control of what is offered to fans by tracks.  Sellers of goods and services to racers and tracks remove racers from the "top three" classes which most fans now go to see and set an entry level cost to race many would be racers cannot meet. 

 

 

The short of it is in my opinion sellers of services and mandatory items to racers have and are reducing the amount of cars available to race in both the "top three" classes and the bottom entry level classes.  What is touted as entry level racing is in reality the controlled sales of goods and services to a specific group of customers. 

 

Any increase in sales to the specific targeted group of customers, sucks cars from the "top three" and pushes out all possible racers below the targeted income level.

Edited by dirtstudent2, 07 November 2017 - 10:15 AM.

[dirtstudent2]

All those words and no real point. Just stop.

 

Sorry I tried my best but slipped.  With only indoor racing next weekend in Columbus Ohio to look forward too, winter racing withdrawal is tough to fend off by stopping.   

[Chad's Dad]

Painesville canceled last Sunday and is rescheduled for Saturday afternoon, according to their Facebook page.  They also have an Enduro on the 25th.

[dirtstudent2]

Painesville canceled last Sunday and is rescheduled for Saturday afternoon, according to their Facebook page.  They also have an Enduro on the 25th.

 

Thank you i'll have to check out and see what their racing. 

 

It's hard for them to put on a show any better or more exciting then what you'd see indoor's kart racing in Columbus.  And indoors out of the wind with a 39 degree temp in Columbus Ohio is easier to handle than it would be in the wind outdoors off of Lake Erie in Painsville. 

https://www.facebook...02104559865178/

 

 

edit:  couldn't find a working website for them but found this on facebook.

 

The Painesville Speedway

23 hrs · 

THIS WEEKEND!!!!!!

Friday, November 10th 
Practice from 5 to dusk! As soon as it gets dark there will be no more cars permitted on the track! Feel free to stay after and have a blast just like this past weekend!!

Saturday, November 11th!

Pits - 10am
Hot Laps - 12pm
Grandstands - 12:30pm
Racing - 2:15pm

Pits: $40

Grandstands- 
Adults: $12
Seniors 65+: $8
Children 6-12: $5
Kids 5 and Under: FREE

Running Order: Factory Four, Modifieds, Renegades, Street Stocks, Outlaw Compacts, Stock Compacts, Figure Eight, Compact F8!

 

 

Edited by dirtstudent2, 07 November 2017 - 01:52 PM.

[flash49]

 

Then i'm a demoter of racing which requires a high percentage of mandatory purchases beyond proven safety equipment, to enter a class of racing. 

 

_________________________________

 

 

 

I'd like to get back to the original subject I tried to get readers on here and especially track owners to think about "Selling tickets, pit passes and concessions verses Selling cost effective racing". 

 

Someone brought up on this site which I can't find again about how car counts for tracks are hurt because there is a special show every weekend taking racers away from local points series.  I agree with what I understood the writer to say.  My point and the point I tried to make with this thread is controlled speck racing for the purpose of selling goods and services to racers does the same. 

 

A forced purchase entry class or move to a controlled cost class is aimed at a particular group of customers.  It takes lower budget racers away from the "top three" classes.  If demanded as a class by tracks it stops all racers who cannot financially meet the new higher "entry level" cost from racing.  I think it also reduces the perceived need for promotion by tracks to gain fans and replaces it with promotion by sellers of goods and services to a specific group of racing customers.  The guise presented to track owners is that dwindling profits from fans can be made up with back gate cost tacked onto racers.  The truth of the matter is to survive and increase profits sellers of mandatory controlled goods and services to racers feed off of controlled car count, not the front or back gate.  Tracks are only a market place for sellers of speck goods and services to racers.  They are business people and nothing else who when and if business slows will move on to something new.   

 

To those who are into racing to sell products and services, tracks are nothing but a cheap store front and controlled customers.  They are no different then the controlled customer racers they sell to.  It's only track owners, racers and fans who are there every Saturday night because of their love of racing.  The only love for racing sellers of goods and services have is about the profits they can take from racers or acquire using what track owners have built.     

 

In my opinion the future and possible complete downfall of racing in this area will be the result of sellers of products and services taking control of local track venues.  To survive sellers of products and services to racers and tracks must have control of what is offered to fans by tracks.  Sellers of goods and services to racers and tracks remove racers from the "top three" classes which most fans now go to see and set an entry level cost to race many would be racers cannot meet. 

 

 

The short of it is in my opinion sellers of services and mandatory items to racers have and are reducing the amount of cars available to race in both the "top three" classes and the bottom entry level classes.  What is touted as entry level racing is in reality the controlled sales of goods and services to a specific group of customers. 

 

Any increase in sales to the specific targeted group of customers, sucks cars from the "top three" and pushes out all possible racers below the targeted income level.

 

The amount of cars racing in the top three divisions has come about because of the tremendous costs to run such an operation.  Whatever you might think of Crate Racing, it keeps people racing who otherwise would be parked, not running in the top three divisions.  I don't know what's so hard to understand about this.  Many racers keep coming on here saying just that, but apparently a lot of you folks don't believe it.  If there was no market for these services and mandatory items, then these classes would not be growing as they have been.

[dirtstudent2]

 

The amount of cars racing in the top three divisions has come about because of the tremendous costs to run such an operation.  Whatever you might think of Crate Racing, it keeps people racing who otherwise would be parked, not running in the top three divisions.  I don't know what's so hard to understand about this.  Many racers keep coming on here saying just that, but apparently a lot of you folks don't believe it.  If there was no market for these services and mandatory items, then these classes would not be growing as they have been.

 

Until now I have never mentioned Crate racing nor referred to it one time in this thread.  I have expressed thoughts about how I think forcing racers to buy from specific part and services suppliers effects and has effected our local Saturday night points racing.  I also have agreed with what I remember reading on this site about how having weekly special shows hurts local Saturday night points racing.  I have also expressed my feeling that forcing racers to purchase specific parts and services does nothing to help racers, tracks and local racing.

 

Tracks forcing racers to run in specific classes like the "top three", Emods, different types of stocks and now front wheel drive does nothing to hurt racing, except for the stupidity of each track having slightly different rules.

 

The cost thing is simple. 

 

Either you can afford to run quality equipment up front in a class or you cannot.  If your a racer it ain't going to keep you from racing and being beat to crap on here by purveyors of words about how you have no business out there unless you have nice shinny stuff to run.  Adding a class to suit the financial needs of every Tom, Dick, Harry and Sue racer does nothing to help racing,  It does everything though to advance the distribution of participation trophies and line the pockets of those selling parts and services to racers.

 

I understand the mentality of racers chasing classes to find someplace you fit in and have a decent chance to be successful.   Been there done that.  I also understand a racers love and a life effort of racing and striving to be the best they can with what they have.  And even trying to make a buck in it at at the top of the food chain without a pot to pee in.  Which is harder going after and finding someplace where you can fit in or going for the top knowing your odds of getting their ain't shit?  All these new friggen classes are there for one reason and one reason only and it's not about doing anything good for racing. 

 

No matter how many races you attend, no matter how much you study the sport and talk to racers, no matter how many tracks you've owned or cars you've owned or supported, no matter how much you have moved your place as a fan towards a glorified racing support position, if the butt of your backside ain't in a race car or has never been in a race car you don't really understand racing and the need to yes even put your life on the line participating and doing your best to win.  And the not understanding, the tricking of mind to think you may understand racing, includes me.  

Edited by dirtstudent2, 07 November 2017 - 09:07 PM.

[Walt Wimer]

Its real simple............................

[Walt Wimer]

Its real simple!!.................................................CUT THE NUMBER OF CLASSES!!!!            No track should be running more than FOUR classes!!    But very few are!!    I grew up when there was just one class, the old coupes.  Everyone had to qualify to make the feature. They ran heats, semi-finals and then a consolation for those who still hadn't qualified.  And if you didn't make it you loaded up, drank a couple of beers and came back the next week and tried again!!    I do think that sometimes we create classes so that everyone can win, and that just doesn't work.    As you guys know, I have never been a driver, car owner or mechanic. I am just a fan and member of the media, and that's the way I see it from my side of the fence!!

 

GOOD RACING TO ALL!!!

 

Walt

[Chrome Horn]

 

The amount of cars racing in the top three divisions has come about because of the tremendous costs to run such an operation.  Whatever you might think of Crate Racing, it keeps people racing who otherwise would be parked, not running in the top three divisions.  I don't know what's so hard to understand about this.  Many racers keep coming on here saying just that, but apparently a lot of you folks don't believe it.  If there was no market for these services and mandatory items, then these classes would not be growing as they have been.

 

 

The amount of cars racing in the top three divisions has come about because of the tremendous costs to run such an operation.  Whatever you might think of Crate Racing, it keeps people racing who otherwise would be parked, not running in the top three divisions.  I don't know what's so hard to understand about this.  Many racers keep coming on here saying just that, but apparently a lot of you folks don't believe it.  If there was no market for these services and mandatory items, then these classes would not be growing as they have been.

You might as well talk to a wall flash, some of these people don't get what you're trying to say. They would rather kill off the crates and enjoy watching 10 super late models every week because that's "real" racing. All these tracks have done nothing to try to help the racer with cost. Lernerville makes you run a certain tire, same with Pittsburgh. I remember when PPMS started the spec motor program back in the 90s. It allowed drivers who had talent but not the $$$ to buy a Draime motor stay competitive. Then once the guys who spent the big $$ started getting it handed to them by spec motors, they all cried about how unfair it was and blah blah. Eventually the spec motor was killed off and the guys with the big $$$ got their wish. Funny thing is, back in those days you had over 20 cars weekly, now you get 10 a week and people blame crate motors when the real blame lies elsewhere.