169 replies to this topic

[Paul55]

Lets see, how many times have I been through the "we are doing this to save the racers money" Well I had a spec motor (home built) and won, okay u need and "economy" engine, even though I had to basically scrap the spec. Built an economy engine  (home built and won). Both costing less to build and made more power than a crate engine, what was wrong with those engines other than they required a tech inspector to do his job. So with all that money spent they want you to buy this junk crate engine that for what it costs I could build a legal engine and make more HP for the same if not less. This sport has evolved from people that could build things ,engine one of the most expensive items of the car and( if tech is done right could compete with the bought engine), to basically forcing those people out of the sport for having to buy a piece of junk that you can't fix yourself. Most automotive repair shops or gas stations use to have a race car, why? because that's what the people who worked there did, fixed or built them. Not had a big pile of cash to buy.   I have been hearing talk of crate engine in the Stock/ Sportsman class, what do you think that is going to do to the car counts?  Also make the track smooth and slick, then you have to drive not hold the gas pedal down and hang on. I would rather watch cars going 80 mph and race side by side than watch "Hot laps" at 110mph.

yup agree. But now it's to far gone now to fix. Wouldn't even know where u would start to fix it besides slicking the track up.

Edited by Paul55, 22 April 2015 - 08:29 AM.

[The Legend]

Remove the wiring harness from the water truck !!! Make the crate cars run ungrooved unsiped 1600's add weight to the 604 to make the 602 the preferred engine , 1 shock only on the LR and a spec bilstein right front with 100# compression and 50# rebound @3" per second. That's how you fix the crates to make them affordable to race every week. Stop watering the track and I will be there almost every week with a spec

[Racer17L]

Jon, how is putting PPMS on an island with unique Crate rules going to help draw more cars?  It won't.  You can't create a Crate division that doesn't adhere to what RUSH/CARS/RIP FASTRACK are doing at the time.  When Charlier goes to race at Sharon or Dabecco goes to the Knob the car is the same.  Who in the hell is going to make all those changes to their car to race at PPMS? No one.  Now if you are talking in essence an Econo Mod type totally new division I'm totally with you there.  But there's not enough cars going around to even do that.  If you can't afford to run some form of LM now you run a Sportsman.  It used to be you raced an Emod but since PPMS and The Knob dropped them they are only getting huge car counts up north so that's not even an option. 

 

Making the track bone dry isn't going to help.  I'm with Danny in that the mid 90's black slick top to bottom was some of the worst racing I've ever seen.  Since the SLM aren't part of the weekly program any way there's no need to slow the track down.  I have yet to hear a Crate driver or a Sportman driver (the two main classes left) once say man if this track was bone dry I would love it and we'd have more cars!

 

The issue is weekly dirt track racing in whole is a mature business which does not have an influx of youth to support it.  Pete was saying how every garage used to have a car.  He's 100% right.  No one is into it nowadays the way it was 10-15 years ago.  It's a shame.

[The Legend]

Vince you are such a nut hugging dumb ass. A 130 dollar shock for the right front doesn't put a track on an " island "

[The Legend]

If crates are all they have ppms
Is done. They need super lates not go carts. The suggestions I made would
Make crates massively more competitive and cheaper to race . I don't see slick tracks through those dick colored lenses you do, it's called forcing people to drive not stomp and steer.

[IMPERIALTIRE11]

Idk Vince but every division I raced in the past had 20 or 30 cars and side by side racing all through the field. When was the last time someone used the brake pedal to set up a pass instead of just a slide job hope it works or just use another car to get through the corner.      And people are not into it because they took the individuality out of the sport, we use to put a cam, gear, set up in the car for how I liked to drive it not how GM thinks it should be or this is the shocks and the set up everyone is running.  Vince drive a crate engine and you will know what I am talking about and I had a 602 and a 604, hold it to the floor till your leg gets tired you can't lift or your done.

Edited by IMPERIALTIRE11, 22 April 2015 - 10:18 AM.

[starboyshady]

Ill say it , a hammer down racetrack sucks ! Especially when there is no tech checking the cars. I hear that there are cars with NO SEAL BOLTS AT ALL & then there is the "cheater" powers or Powell motors that a known to be illegal and no one even checked them

[The Legend]

Competitive racing requires throttle and car control , the current state of ppms crate racing requires neither. If a guy has the slightest push he's screwed and a half of a lap Down with nothing he can do from the seat to change that. If it's dead slick you can adjust your line , brake bias etc etc ... When your on the mat that doesn't matter !! If you can go laps without lifting motors blow up and races aren't competitive

[Racer17L]

I'm still waiting for someone to explain to me where any more than 9 SLM are going to come from if you slick up the track and have them running 22.5 second laps.

And I raced an Emod with 650 HP on 8" tires. Completely understand the skill to drive in non hammer down conditions. But again how does that ADD cars? My argument is about adding cars.

Lastly- I guess the 96 Pittsburgher in 18 second hammer down conditions was the worst race in the history of mankind then. I'm not saying it has to be corn field hammer down conditions weekly. But you can still have a fast smooth surface without the crater in turn 3 and a black ring in the middle after hot laps.

[Racer17L]

One more thing- I've heard from at least 6 different Sportsman drivers who came to my dads race last year and will be back BECAUSE the track was so good and not slick. They all said it was the best track they've ever races on and asked me if it would be the same this year. To them it was so much easier to adjust their cars and gears to have a fighting chance at a track they don't race at a lot. So to me that creates competitive racing. Last year we set record times in the race and had ONE caution In the feature. So how wasn't all kind of equipment torn up when they didn't race in a Sahara desert?

[The Legend]

Ok Vince let me break this down to second grade shit for you ..... The last 4 weeks of 2013 Alex feree basically ran WFO against the wall and nearly lapped the field every night , the one night mollick did the same thing. Running a 430 at Pittsburgh WFO like that will need freshened at around 750 laps or it's a ticking time bomb. That freshening is between 10and 15 k !! That's if they don't blow it up first Turning it 8800. On those track conditions you need that to win. People can't afford to run like that for 1200 to win and the track can't afford to pay more. Many many many super late races have been won by spec motors and lower dollar opens like Jim Stephan's won 2
Races in 1 year with. Stephan's was selling his complete race ready car for less than an engine freshening at a big time builder. If track conditions do not require 800 hp to win more guys can afford to race. A spec engine can be rebuilt In a guys garage for a couple grand after 2200 laps instead of 750 laps. Do you get it yet ???! On the correct conditions your not even full throttle with that spec. Track conditions are the great equalizer that prevents money for buying all of the wins. I am sure if they kept the place slick and easy on equipment car counts would climb.

[The Legend]

Vince what your saying is your a talentless jack off and can afford a better motor than the guys you race against and you want to take advantage of that ... That's the different between me and you, I have 4 Cornett open motors and I realize runnin them for 1200 is retarded and if track conditions require that type of power super late racing is screwed . I'm think about the best interest of the sport and your thinking about you can afford to buy an advantage . And that jack off way of thinking is why Saturday was what Saturday was

[Racer17L]

Jon you lost me here as I was racing against 750+ HP Rousch engines at the end of Emods and was running a 2001 chassis down 150+ HP nightly. But anyway I'm suggesting a happy medium between WFO conditions and Sahara desert track. That's it.

[The Legend]

And if you were competitive down 150 hp it's because the track was slick !!!! Which meant you didnt need the RYR power to win !!!! The motor you had was good enough and cheaper than the RYR !!! What aren't you understanding ??? The less power you can put to the ground the less expensive it is to race

[Racer17L]

I completely 100% agree with you.  But we aren't talking emods here any longer, nor SLM as there were only 9 of them anyway and they are specials mostly now.  Outside of Lernerville most nights, who even runs SLM weekly, let alone get 20+ good cars?  No one!  You want to slow down crates, which are all running 604's anyway, and think that will magically bring in more fans and cars.  It wont.  It's not like there are 10 PPMS cars going to other tracks because of the conditions.  There just aren't enough cars to go around period.  Outside of Keith Barbara at the Knob, who else would come back?  Do you think Mel Minick and Scott Rhodes will magically become PPMS regulars if the track slicks off?  You think any Lernerville guys would come?  Russ King?  Chuck Sarver?  Christ there were only 17 at Lernerville!  Mercer cars?  There are none.  Sharon?  Nope.  Who is going to come out of retirement to run your ice rink?

[The Legend]

I have a spec , Geisler has a spec , Miley has a spec , mike Johnson has a spec , baker has a spec and theres plenty used specs for sale especially south . A used solid spec can be had for under 10k and run 2200 laps with minimal work. And the open motors can still run !! If you think street stocks will save the place you are huffing glue. As traveling super late racing becomes more and more prohibitive you have the possibility of guys like
Barbra coming back on a more regular basis if Matt would wake up an apologize to all of the people he told to luck off over the years

[The Legend]

Beck , burgoon and gunn have all races specs before and could all possibly run one if they keep the track conditions conducive to it

[BUTTBEAK]

I wasn't @ the track this week.... and probably won't be unless it's a SLM race.

If the sun had shined steady into the evening the track would of loosened up ... from what I was told by a good source.

You can't control the weather.

You should expect grip in the track in early spring & early Fall.

 

Crates are a far cry from go-carts.

Hell, they run faster laps than some lates in the slick....... as a standing rule!

 

Don't discredit the driving ability of the crate guys, they are wheeling... and must be on with their set to turn fast times

As far as tires go most of the crates ARE on D55's (same compound as 1600 FYI), except for soft tracks and cool conditions that warrant/allow the D21.

 

Unified rules,like RUSH series, are good for the sport and car counts.

 

 

I do think that crates play an important part in local racing and do help keep the sport growing.

When the time and $ is right, these are the super lates of the future.

 

Someone has to replace the great PPMS local weekend competitors, past and present like: Geisler,Baker,Bradich,Ben Miley,Stephans,Banal,Wade,Mike Johnson, Babara,Atallah,Ed Feree,etc.

 

With the spec CID opened up 406, the small bore ones became obsolete.

 

Bolt in a crate with your 'couch change'........ and see if you can lose the brand of the backmarker.

[Squirrely Hilly]

What was the reason to open the spec motor up to 406 ci?   Let me guess, it had something to do with benefitting Ben Miley, Jared Miley, Broughers or all of the above.  THAT right there is one reason they will always be a laughingstock of promoters in the Pittsburgh area and one of the reasons for the failure of the track.  A good promoter does not field race teams at their own track.

[racer67x]

What was the reason to open the spec motor up to 406 ci?   Let me guess, it had something to do with benefitting Ben Miley, Jared Miley, Broughers or all of the above.  THAT right there is one reason they will always be a laughingstock of promoters in the Pittsburgh area and one of the reasons for the failure of the track.  A good promoter does not field race teams at their own track.

notice how last week the crates were the "big" paying division and here comes Jared in one?

lol..gotta keep the money somehow.
and Jon,you can rant all you want about the track being watered too much but the best nights are when it starts out fairly wet then feature time it slicks off with a real thin cushion for those brave enough to go up by the wall to find it.
the racing sucks when its sheepsfooted into concrete with dust up top..